Lamina1 is monetizing creativity and IP for creators

0:01I'm Ashen Addison from the Cryptocoin Show and today on Blockchain Interviews, we have Rebecca Barkin, co-founder and CEO of Lamina 1. Rebecca, welcome to the show and thanks for taking the time. Yeah, thanks so much for having me. Um, it's really nice to to be here. Well, I I just uh did one a couple weeks ago where I was talking to primarily like a

0:21creative and immersive crowd about why to why to think about blockchain and crypto and how to think about it a little differently. So, this will be great. little different. Yeah, I'm super interested in the development of the creator economy, more ways to monetize for sure. You know, being a content creator myself, everyone is really becoming a content creator nowadays. Um,

0:42and monetization is a nice touch. You know, you can only create so much uh until you need to pay the rent. Uh, and so there's always that part as well. Excited to dive into what you and the team have built at Lamina 1. Uh, and all of the recent updates that I heard about as well. excited to dive into that. Let's start with a high level overview of Lamina 1. What's the platform all

1:04about? How does it have to do with the creator economy? And then we can dive into all those details. Yeah, sure. So, uh is it cool if I give a little bit of background too on just kind of how we got here and the original vision? Yeah. So um I co-founded uh Lamina 1 together with Neil Stevenson um who I worked with to develop uh IP for like augmented

1:27reality and different things like that uh at Magic Leap uh where I ran their studios. Many of you may know Neil as um he's a legendary sci-fi author um and and technologist as well. Um he actually was like one of the first employees at Blue Origin and people don't always know that. Um but he is the man who articulated and actually coined the term metverse um as a concept in 1992 in his

1:53uh seminal novel Snow Crash. He's also like in the 90s which is pretty crazy written books like Diamond Age which foretold like personalized AI um and uh crypto cryptonomicon which foraw like the rise of digital currency. So he's like kind of a legend in this arena, although some of the younger people I think maybe don't know where a lot of those ideas came from. So um we founded

2:17Lamina 1 basically to be a creator owned platform uh and builtin economy for like direct to consumer IP incubation, distribution and monetization. And um I kind of the easiest way to describe it is like imagine if YouTube instead of being owned by Google was owned by the creators and the validators that ran the network that supported it. That's what

2:42we're after. And and quite frankly like I think it's time has come. Um and you know in terms of my background and why this was like a you know a natural next step for me. Um I started my career in music uh in the music business and then in film um just as like kind of both industries were being uh you know wrecked and and rebuilt by new technologies and and

3:10often like the the kind of anonymous anarchists behind it that were like that were driving things like Pirate Bay and Lime Wire and all these changes to the industry. And so it was really clear to me that like tech was taking the wheel in terms of determining the business model of of entertainment, humanities and arts like going forward, which was like a little scary because their

3:31incentives are very different. Mhm. Um and so I went down the rabbit hole after the entertainment business after kind of going through that cycle with music and film, moved to Silicon Valley. Um and then went kind of deep on all those poor technologies that would inform the future of entertainment. So like at this point I had you know I've spent over 20

3:52years um leading creative and technical teams at some of the world's most ambitious experiential projects. So things like medicine square garden sphere um the mukab uh which is part of the the south vision 2030 like you know kind of big um you know those giga projects massive experiential projects. Magic Leap um which was a a pretty infamous AR company that raised four and

4:17a half billion uh Knob Labs which was an AI acquisitional tracking company etc. So anyway um this was kind of like a why doesn't this exist? We've seen with every every sort of new iteration and new technology and this is AI is we're seeing the same sort of thing happen with AI. Every time there's new technologies available to creators that seemingly are going to make things

4:42easier for creators to self-publish or to do previs work or whatever it is that helps them sort of deliver their idea to the world. Um these technologies are supposed to support them in being able to do that. But what ends up happening often is on the economics the economics get worse and worse and worse. And that's certainly been true as we've become like slave to algorithms and and

5:04adriven models. So that's why we felt it was time to build Lamina. Um, and it's really a place where we encourage people to kind of retain audience ownership and retain IP ownership. So, come with us, own, expand, and really maximize the value of your IP on the platform. That's an amazing intro, Rebecca, and I I agree. uh I don't want to be a slave to

5:26the algorithms and been long enough that we've been using these traditional social platforms where we don't feel like we own the content that we create or or the audience or the monetization of it or at least you're getting pennies on the dollar while meanwhile the the platform is is taking it all. So it's definitely time. That's right. And I think to your point um they they also

5:48just the the you have to consider the incentives and like the alignment of incentives, you know, like a lot of the the the tech platforms that are that are driving these things and that are even funding the creation of content, funding the creator economy. They need that content um to make their business model work. But often they're driven by like a software

6:11and hardware buying cycle, right? Like you know when you think about Apple, right? Why did they start studio? Why did they start music? Um it's to sell more hardware and more software, right? That's a very different sort of um perspective on content development than a true creative who wants to deliver a story to the world. And so, not to say that they don't care and they don't

6:33value, they have great people at Apple who really know how to make great content, but I think it's really important, especially in the age of AI, um, and how much time and money we're all investing in the internet, uh, that that creators, um, remain sort of in charge and and have a way to be prosperous uh, in delivering, you know, those great stories and ideas to the world. Because

6:57what we're going to start to see is this kind of like desensitization to um to all the sort of work that can be created now with AI and by just anyone, right? That sort of the thing is like oh my god, everybody can create and it's like sure. Uh but those really incredible stories that stick with us and that define us and define humanity. Um we still need to give space and

7:21oxygen to the people who uh who bring those to us, right? Um, and I think we have to do that outside of the constant pressure to deliver for a techdriven or an ad- driven business model. Definitely. I'm glad to see things shifting towards more creatorowned and and decentralized governance as well, which maybe we can dive into after. I'd love to get a paint a picture of uh the

7:47the platform and the differences in the evolution from what people are used to on the traditional platform where they're not getting much. Say I go to Lamina 1 as a content creator and maybe I am a a digital artist or musician or a vlogger. What are the focuses right now? Are you able to put in any of that type of content on the platform and then monetize from it? Yeah, so we're in the

8:14process of um we launched both a platform and a protocol, right? So you you have to do work to establish both. It's almost like driving two different products. Um what Lamina 1 has uh today is what we call a hub which is like web two cell onboarding a home base for managing your assets primarily 2D assets at the moment. Um content discovery of other people with 2D assets. It's about

8:36about 25,000 pieces of artwork have been uploaded since we started and and launched late last year. Um what's coming next in terms of a big product development is something that we call spaces and that is really IP specific fan communities uh with premium features like uh you know diversity of kind of content that you can share like media files and whatnot um as well as AI

8:59co-creation tooling right uh token gated content co-creation storefronts and marketplace capability we're not building all of that ourselves like what we what we saw and I What was a really good learning for me coming into this industry is like there's a million protocols. Like there's a lot of people doing very specific things really well, but no one who who has a problem that

9:26this technology can solve has any idea how to put all of that together and then like use it to drive their own interests like content creation, right? like it's just a mess of things that you have to put together. It's so fragmented, you know. Um so what we thought was like let's look instead of spending all of our time building proprietary IP or another pro protocol

9:51that we have to differentiate from other D5 protocols that are out there. Um instead of you know launching our own layer 1 when we're not even sure like why don't any of the other layer ones satisfy what was already needed you know because we thought a lot of the problems were at the application layer. So, we said, let's look at the best of the best

10:08out there and let's let's focus on really really smooth integration of those things into one consistent platform. Um, and our token pretty much at the moment um you can use it for gas fees, but it's also like got a lot of governance features, right? A lot of it is meant to drive uh community ownership over things like what we call the monetary authority which determines

10:29release and unlock schedules based on macro and microeconomics as well as um the open metverse arts council which is um a community uh elected board which will help kind of inform economic adjustments as they serve the creative community specifically. So basis is coming very soon. that's kind of going to be our flagship product and it's based on you

10:53know two years of working with creators to say what do you actually need uh in a platform what why why would you leave Instagram why would you leave YouTube why do those not satisfy you um what can we do here and I think the IP specific universes is important because um right now like content is organized based on networks and channels and who has distribution very specific rights.

11:21It's not really organized around the fan community, which is what drives investment in IP, right? And development for the development of IP. So, if we could make it easier for people to use their existing identity and assets to kind of swim between uh you know, universes created by a same the same IP holder that they might love like Neil. Um then we could really

11:44change sort of the way that content is organized and presented to both you know fan and IP holder and we could allow and reward the IP holder for hanging on to their rights uh and the fan uh for investing continually in a certain IP that they love. Right? So um we have a limit one protocol and token. we have the hub um or staking and governance like I mentioned um is that kind of is

12:09designed to support that economic flywheel that keeps creators and fans really earning and reinvesting in co-creation um you can stake uh as many many of our creators have done the people who are holding our token right now are creators that's how they got it um and then we also have the advantage of having Neil an IP holder in house right so we are developing a proprietary

12:35um kind of like it's a little bit of an experiment, but I'm really excited about it because it's native to web 3. It like takes what web 3 is really good at, but then it doesn't fully abandon what makes web 2 IP communities really attractive long term. Um, and it's very sort of agile creative development and world building directly with a community. So,

12:55I'm excited about that. We announced it in Variety last year and we're we're developing it uh now. It should be out in like Q3. Um, so those are sort of it's both protocol and its platform because the thing was is like protocol alone just like the creative community was like I don't I don't know what this is like I'm not a for them like crypto is memes you know and we really had to

13:21change that that stigma and I I think on that note the one thing I'd say too is like a lot of times you have tech bros that try to solve problems for industries that they're not personally invested in And like we wonder why they're unsuccessful. They might be really f they might be funded to high heaven, but like if you don't deeply understand the problem

13:41you're solving and the community you're solving it for, um if you don't regularly have like a treasure trove of information and insights you can go to within that community to say, "Why isn't this working?" Um that's going to be a real disadvantage. Like you're going to hit a ceiling even if like you trade well early on or or there's a promise of it or

14:02can buy the short, whatever the hell you're doing. Um, but like, you know, eventually your luck's going to run out because you need content to to like uh to supply the platform. You need a supplier, right? And the it's double-sided market. Like you you got to have the content and you got to have the community and um you can't get one without the other. So, I think the

14:24protocol is meaningless unless people are using it in the way that that you intended them to use it. And so what we said was like nobody gives a about decentralization like in the creative community. They don't know what it means. It's very abstract as a concept. If you explain it within terms they understand um like AI abuses or data abuses or things

14:46like that then then it starts to like hit home a little bit. But on the surface nobody cares about pushing decentralization forward. They care about you solving a problem for them. And what we saw was the problem in the entertainment industry was that nothing could get funded. And like for all the tech that was out there, there were no great tools for

15:08amplifying marketing distribution, which is why studios were able to sort of retain a strangle hold um on the economic situation there. While you could use digital for cheap distribution, how do you scale it to make those economics meaningful for greater so they don't go the traditional distribution route? Mhm. And so these problems of distribution, marketing, and

15:29financing of independent projects were becoming such a hot topic in Los Angeles that you started to see directors um and writers and people kind of abandoning the traditional system and saying, "I've been waiting 5 years to get this made or I walked into a studio and a studio and I pitched them on a concept and now they own it like and I've been waiting for

15:53three years for them to figure out how to fund it or so like the the it was it was sort of uh serendipitous, right? Because the the market problem was become was boiling over at the same time that the tech was maturing enough to be able to solve it. And so that's where we really have have focused. Um yeah. Yeah. No, that that's uh in context to to understand um this shift in the content

16:23creators trying to get as much as they can of their own content that they write. Um I think you hit the uh the nail on the on the head when you're talking about no one really cares about decentralization. If you're an artist, if you're a content creator, uh whatever the means to the end is that you're actually getting what you rightfully own, that's what they they they care

16:45about and they're able to monetize without being u you know taken advantage of from from traditional platforms. So where does that where does that balance lie in the platform in catering to the hundreds of millions of creators that don't really understand decentralization or crypto but having that on the back end as the technology that's actually it

17:08is the catalyst in that makes it so that they're getting more of what they deserve without them really having to know how it works. Right. Well, I mean you want to keep them in the space that they're good at, right? which is developing stories and creatives. So we have um a project that we uh just announced um that was from the creators of of Bob's Burgers and Pig Plus Cat.

17:31These are like Emmy award-winning writers and directors. They opted out um of the traditional system. They had offers. They opted out. Um and we really sat with them for a long time to understand what they needed and why they opted out. And you know it helps that they have enough of a following and enough of an establishment in terms of like their success and credibility to be

17:53able to try a different path. They were primarily concerned with like we want to build community first. Um we want to have enough of a following and retain our rights so that we can make the decisions we think are best for the content versus the network. Like best for the the development of the the IP and the content, the quality versus like just the network.

18:16So yeah, we were just talking about, you know, how how do you get people to do this and and to try this and see the value of blockchain and and crypto and creating a new economy? And I think the the bottom line is you need a couple of really really great examples and and uh creators with high credibility to lead the way. Um and you'll see the same thing on uh AI usage as well. like you

18:40want to see directors like Paul Trillo or you want to see VFX you know Oscar award-winning VFX supervisors like John Gada starting an AI film platform these are people who are fundamentally creatives themselves who found use in the tools right um to do something different than they'd done before not to disadvantage the industry not to disadvantage other creatives in it um

19:03their incentive is aligned and that's kind of what I was trying to talk about earlier is like I want to hear how creatives use AI. When we get on stage and we, you know, I go to the Venice Film Festival every year and talk with uh creatives who are developing immersive content about how they're getting funded, how they're managing production, what you want to do is you

19:21want to have creators talk to other creators about why they chose a platform like this. And it's not important whether it's blockchain, it's not important if it's, you know, uh, you know, crypto or how they talk about the token. What what it is is it's a new platform that allows them to retain direct ownership of their IP and direct ownership of their audience and then

19:42incentivize their audience to keep sort of spreading the word and almost be the new kind of ANR scouts uh of their own industry. that I think is really exciting and and I think it's going to be really meaningful because even what you're seeing in the advertising industry with AI um I I just read from uh Zoe Ga the other day that you know publicist this great post about the the

20:04state of the advertising industry uh publicist has has hired 25,000 engineers specifically to build out their AI capabilities. uh WPP is investing really heavily in stability AI and and Infosom and and this this Omnicom IPG merger you know at its core is a very strategic sort of venture to combine resources um around AI investments and capabilities. So, so

20:32industries are embracing something like AI and they're also and brands are also looking at like how do we leverage our communities and the current sort of tool sets that are out there for our communities to also start making creative and advertisements on behalf of our brand. like, you know, there's a huge expectation um for interactivity, interactivity with

20:56the brands I love, interactivity with the IP that I love, and now you've got the tool sets to to enable uh your community to be able to be like almost like ambassadors for it and creatives for it. So, you have this creator economy that can rise up within and underneath these these tremendous sort of franchise uh companies. So, I think media overall is changing with this new

21:18technology. And what we need to make sure is the right IP tracking and permissions um and and incentivizations are aligned to be able to continue to feed that community to get richer and richer versus sort of like that that uh industry becoming wholly owned by a different industry which is incentivized in a whole is motivated by a whole different set of of

21:45um you know of success right metrics for success. So, um, I think, you know, there's a lot of great tech out there. We're trying to use the best of it on the platform. We're trying to do it in a way that's really respectful. So, you know, you can permission the way that people are using AI. You can say whether you want your your project or your creative to be used for AI. You can

22:06track royalties, you can track metadata, you can track uh with full transparency people's participation in an IP. Those are the kinds of things we need to pay respect to the industry that we're using this technology to solve a problem for. Because I think we've all sort of had it with technology companies saying to creative people um your creative work has no value while

22:32they simultaneously mine it to create, you know, the best AI model in the world, right? And build a business model off of it that that's very different. So I I think this is the right time um for this kind of thing and we're seeing that kind of adoption too like we're uh we're on avalanche and uh currently and we uh we're we have our own L1 there. Uh we've

22:58seen you know we have about 312,000 uh wallets worldwide right now and 30% of those are active uh you know we have about 80 to 100,000 daily active users 500,000 transactions daily and we just launched in you know formerly in November uh late November um so we're really starting to see the pickup and I think part of that is because we're not talking just to crypto we're talking to

23:24the people we're going to we're going to use this core technology to solve a problem for. So, I think that's really important. And there are some great other folks in um in crypto right now that are looking at media as well as like the next big area to disrupt. Definitely, that's incredible uh growth and uh daily active users. uh and especially because November was around

23:46the time in in crypto where there was a lot of hype and it's uh been the for the shortsighted ones it's been disappointing in the last couple months uh thinking that the Trump administration was going to push everything to the moon and uh and it's been sort of sideways but it's the cycles of uh of digital assets and I'm sure the next one will be even crazier

24:08um and and at the same time AI is really developing further. I'm curious your take on where we're at with the content creation side of AI. It seems like, you know, before text and knowledge over the last two years has really developed and matured, and now we're starting to see more with images and soon video that's going to be it's it's I think it'll be

24:32unfathomable what people will be able to create uh in in a year or two. How do you think that will affect content creators and that are looking to monetize their own content using those new AI tools as they mature to do so? So, I think you will see IP universes and and really like major franchises like whether it's DC or Marvel or or um ILM and Lucas start to embrace uh fan

24:58and creator economydriven creative with guard rails. So like they are in control of um the way that fans can engage and use AI tooling to create derivative works and then those derivative works can then drive uh rev sharing opportunities that are that kind of result in passive income for the studios and give them a reason to stay more closely engaged with communities which

25:23is something that I think the first wave of like NFTts really missed right is that what is the ongoing incentive for studios to keep feeding an NFT past that initial sale. Like so they they just like lacked utility, right? They didn't continue to grow in value. But I think what you'll start to see is um major franchises figuring out a comfortable uh brand protected permissioned way that

25:50they can allow their fan communities to engage with AI to create new trailers or like you know derivative fan artwork or um even like mini films that are based on peripheral characters or things like that. provided we still give them the mechanisms to protect the quality of that creative franchise. Cuz I mean this is one of the things it's like it's not

26:13that they don't want people to be able to have tools to to make creative like it's not like we're saying this is something only the creative industry knows how to do and stay out of here and and you know people are frustrated about AI for that reason. It's that you have to be respectful of what it took to build a studio jubilee. Like you have to be respectful of what it took to build a

26:36very sort of um distinctive creative direction, art direction like what a workshop has done um in building things like Lord of the Rings and Stranger Things over the, you know, the course of 40 years. Like that is a real expertise that requires um respect and and protection. So, what I'm excited by is is that I'm starting to see uh creatives, directors, writers, uh

27:00studio owners, uh who own those, you know, who who have that kind of um renown IP or creative direction get involved in in actually creating their own uh AI or branding their own AI so that people and fans can interact and create derivative works but in like a permissioned way. And then you can have this kind of creator economy that rises up and becomes the sort of

27:27ambassador and future creatives that carry the torch for um you know a brand or an identity that we all that that's very beloved um going forward. So I think that um those are the conversations I'm really watching. It's not going anywhere. But when you look at these things with with the consistent trends in uh advertising and in uh film making and in studios is that the AI is not

27:55going anywhere. We just need creatives to get more involved in driving the technology in a way that they're comfortable with that is rewarding and that like drives that going forward because otherwise you just end up with a lot of garbage that we're just very very quickly going to start to tune out. like there's going to be a lot of work that's created that just like sits in the

28:15middle and and isn't great. And I know in the crypto world we're talking a lot about like Agentic AI and the advantages that proposes and we are definitely looking into that again like with partners because I think the important thing is to figure out you need some time to figure out where the gaps are before you develop proprietary tech. Um but Aentic AI has a lot of sort of risks

28:34to it uh as well in terms of like passing keys right down the line. So like so one AI can talk to another AI. It can we see the benefit of it in terms of helping a creative from the moment that they get on the platform say I want to launch this kind of um you know this kind of franchise or this kind of work and uh I want to make licensing and merchandising opportunities available to

28:58people. I want to have a proper legal framework underpinning um the royalty structures and the enforcability of it. Like those are going to be great areas for like you know Aentic AI to be able to sort of like help a creator get a project from start to launch. Uh as well as like mark you know creating these kind of international marketing dro hubs that are also incentivizing fans to to

29:22keep spreading the word. But you know we approach these things always with a respect for the creative itself. And I think that that's really really important and I think you're going to start to see a lot more prominent creatives getting involved in that mix. I am excited too about the crowdfunding aspect of it which is starting to come uh to really gain some some heat. you

29:45know, people like Republic and Tribute, um, even Seed and Spark and Kinna who are um, turning to their fan communities and saying, "Hey, we're going to make some really interesting and unique investment opportunities available to you if you'll uh, join us on this ride in developing this IP. Uh, you can have a stake in its performance and and monetization down

30:08the road." Because for us, what we're saying to creatives is like we're not trying to own your work. Mhm. And we're not going to crush it. Like if we deprecate this this platform or move on from this industry, we're not trying to own it. What we're saying is like you own it. This is a new home base for you. Develop your community cuz that's leverage when you go in to have a

30:28conversation with traditional distributors, which we still want you to have. Like go get the Netflix deal you want. go get theatrical distribution for something that you started here, but do it knowing that you have a 100,000 followers globally in your pocket already. Like you have better leverage in negotiating. Um, and if you want to raise from from you know a combination

30:48of traditional investors as well as uh fans, you can do that and Pressman Film just did it on Republic. Robert Rodriguez is ra is raising on Republic now. um where you know fans actually get a chance to own own a stake in the development of a franchise. So I think that's those are really exciting developments and they're unique to you know to I think what blockchain and

31:11crypto it's like transparency economy you know economic sort of rails. Um we just need to get that the application layer sort of platform side polished which is where we were really squarely focused. Definitely some really exciting insights Rebecca. Um, you know, I I I love where this is going and having uh the creatives involved. Um, and you know, there there's so much they can do

31:36to tap into things that they already love, like you're saying, you know, DC and Marvel or Lord of the Rings. If they can work with these uh companies in a way that is mutually beneficial uh with the technology, I feel like that's going to open the doors. You know, we just have to have that cooperation. So, I'm really excited to see where where that goes. Um and you hinted earlier on about

31:57a few updates that you that the platform is working on. Can you talk a little bit about uh the road map in uh the rest of 2025 and what are some of the uh updates and initiatives that you're continuing to drive to the hundreds of thousands of daily active users and more that are coming in? Yeah. So um as we developed the media side of the platform um

32:23obviously the our sort of first our initial step was in establishing um governance and and the token and ensuring stability there and uh and so kind of those native crypto web3 projects um help you do that. You know that because you can't solve scalability and distribution and and make the economic upside uh strong enough if if you don't have the size in the network,

32:47right? So we focused a lot early on on like let's roll out the token. Let's make sure that people have accessibility to it that governance is in place. Um you know and start to roll and and get projects involved that don't require so much handholding like we've had to do a lot on the on the bigger creative projects. There's quite a bit of handholding and that sales cycle is a

33:08little bit longer. So um we focused on that initially but coming up in Q3 will be the rolling out of spaces and some major IP partnerships um that start to drop within the context and framework of those spaces. Um we definitely want to work to integrate partners like Tribute and Republic in Q3 will start to roll in AI co-creation tooling uh on the platform. We currently have like Unity

33:35SDKs and Unreal SDKs and and a bunch of sort of basics, but I think uh you'll start to see that reflection of uh going really towards this media uh 3.0 direction in in Q3. Um that project which is uh that I mentioned earlier from the people behind Bob's Burgers uh and Pig Plus Cat is uh nowhere. That's really exciting. Um that will roll out in a space. Artifact will roll out in a

34:02space. So it's kind of like we want to launch that product which will be a flagship product for us for these IP specific universes with with commerce and and development and social kind of built into them. We want to roll those out in a way that's meaningful and kind of showcases for everyone what you can do. So um there's those kind of flagship projects. Uh and then we also are

34:24announcing uh a huge partnership with uh Numidia Valley which is um kind of a a it's a project from the government of of Algeria and an investment from them uh in developing Africa and the young people in Africa like its curriculum, it's sports and it's gaming. um and they have chosen us as their official uh partner for for you know at the platform level. So we'll

34:49work with them on curriculum, we'll work they'll bring us their sort of their gaming projects um and we'll get to introduce the youngest population in the world to a new way of building uh and developing and and distributing your IP. So I think th those are really exciting things that we're doing and those will take shape within um spaces and they'll

35:09roll out within spaces and that will be in Q3. Um, so everything you kind of need there to support development, distribution, uh, and and monetization will be rolled into spaces and rolled out probably later in Q3. Like right now is a crazy crazy time in the market to try to roll out anything like you can't get a headline right now to save your life because new cycle is so insane. So,

35:31um, you're seeing a lot of people and I'm seeing a lot of projects in the industry like kind of delay their launches and whatnot. Um, and so we we've kind of taken a little bit of the time pressure and rushed to market uh and said, "Listen, right now it's okay to just it's okay to build and build slowly." Um, and let's release in the fall when when we're all pretty

35:54convinced. Um, it'll be a much more favorable time for not only our industry, but sort of the macroeconomic landscape as well. Yeah. No, that's really exciting. And I think the timeline sounds good as well. It's it's pretty crazy right now. And and heads down building is always a good thing. So, I'm looking forward to seeing those updates. Lean and mean. We're like

36:15lean and mean right now. Um but very focused. Uh and I and I think you'll see us announce some really really big strategic partnerships that will um that will support us in expansion and achieving that scale that we know that we need to support proper distribution uh and challenge traditional distribution. It's very cool. And if there are creatives that just want to

36:39test out the platform and also to follow along with these updates as they roll out, I would love to have you back uh when those happen as well. But I know there will be updates in in more real time. What's the best way to to learn more and get involved in the platform? Yeah, I mean on limit one.com you can play around, you can set up a wallet, you can see what functionality is there

36:58now. Um it's a little misleading because right now it kind of feels a little bit uh like an NFT uh marketplace uh without the marketplace functionality because there's just like there's a lot of 2D art and a lot of projects who are getting set up there. Um but check it out and I think you'll get a sense for experience first uh web two level onboarding uh the way that we're

37:20positioning that kind of a platform as truly a place for creatives. Um, if you have a project uh that is you think really well suited for this, maybe it's multimedia, maybe you want to drop a piece of a script, you want to tease out uh creative that you're working on or a curriculum you're developing or um you know there's all different sorts of ways

37:40that we can support that in the next in the coming months. But uh reach out to us at ecosystem atlamina 1. Uh we also are still deploying creator grants. So um you can you know submit to us your projects and if we think it's aligned with the market and what we can support and what we think is a great focus then um we are issuing creator grants as well. Uh so I would encourage people to

38:05go to liinal one and check it out. uh you know, follow us on socials. Um and then if you have an idea for a project, if you're uh a developer, um hit us up and you know, we we have uh a team that is constantly evaluating those creator grants and and we just uh are in the process of electing a you know, a community to be able to vote on on deployment of those

38:30kind of funds and resources to support creators as well. Very cool. Uh I appreciate all this information. It's it's crazy how content creation is evolving and AI is in there. Decentralization on the back end uh moving in a good direction and glad to see there's platforms like Lamina 1 that are supporting uh the right way for content creators to to monetize and get

38:55involved in things that they love. Uh, I'm going to leave the the socials you mentioned in the show notes and the Lamina web platform and uh I love everything that you're you and the team are working on. Would love to follow up in the near future uh before Q3 when those major updates roll out and we can see uh what's coming next in the industry. Yeah, that'd be great. and I I

39:15really appreciate you having me and and I think the more that we we talk about sort of life beyond DeFi and memecoins like real real problems we can solve uh the more that the industry will mature and and stabilize. So thanks for having me uh and being interested.